It doesn’t take that much to go and find out about games like AC:Unity and Arkham Knight that predate NMS. In fact I’m pretty sure Ubisoft and EA are the two companies most notorious for “Release broken fix later” to give you a head start on looking into things.
Discourse surrounding broken game launches/Release Broken Fix Later has been around a bit longer than NMS.
Cyberpunk 2077 was a really ambitious game, with a lot of new mechanics and incredible graphics. Beasts like that are really difficult to optimize for a large range of computers with different specs, so at first it ran poorly on some.
What about all the other “Ambitious games” that we’ve had over the years that come out just fine? A game being ambitious does not excuse a company releasing the game in what is blatantly an unfinished state. This isn’t the case of a game having a few performance hiccups here and there but rather egregious bugs and severe performance issues across the board. This is stuff that is all over youtube, reddit, twitter and so on. It’s pretty well documented how bad the game was.
The most notably buggy release was the PS4 one. And rightfully so. They were trying to run a truly next gen game on a console which was more than a decade old. They not only had to optimize the game, but they basically made a completely different game, with different assets and engines, which was really difficult to do. Still, it was too much for the console, especially old PS4s that were full of dust or had old fans and were overheating.
Again, this really isn’t an excuse. They had the power the can the next gen versions of the game if it was so difficult to pull off. They also had the power to delay the game in order to make sure that it was ready for launch. They could have done so many things such that the last gen versions of the day would either never see the light of day or be ready for launch. CDPR are a big enough studio to pull something like this off. They’re not a small indie studio.
Another important fact is that users were also pressuring CDPR into releasing Cyberpunk 2077. It was delayed at least once (maybe twice, I don’t remember), and people wanted to play the game. They probably had to choose between delaying it another time or releasing it without polishing it that much.
Yes, there may have been pressure. But no, the consumer base does not have anywhere near enough power over corporations like you’re trying to imply. Games aren’t just released early because “Oh no the consumers are getting angy”. Though once again this was their fault due to them giving the consumer a completely unrealistic initial release date that they obviously could not hit, considering the absolute state of the game at launch.
The most likely explanation is that they were simply trying to get the game out as soon as possible to cash in and they absolutely did not want to miss a major sales period such as Christmas. They were simply trying to drop a minimal viable product with plans to fix it later. Turns out they dropped a less than minimally viable product in their rush to make some dosh. Knowingly too if you look into the allegations that I’ll link later.
I believe it was Cyberpunk 2077 that started the trend of “release now fix later” games.
No. “Release broken fix later” has been a thing for maybe the last decade. Do people not remember shitshows like AC:Unity? Cyberpunk is most definitely not the first game to be “Release broken, fix later”.
However, I don’t think they really did it on purpose.
I don’t think it was dropped broken on purpose. But I do think it was an attempt to drop the usual bare minimum product. Just so happens that they miscalculated and dropped something less than minimal. It’s still gross incompetence and shows the consumer they’re more than willing to drop something bare minimum with the promise of fixing it later. Rather than dropping a complete game.
The game was too ambitious for its own good, and having to develop, optimize and test two basically different versions of it was too big of a task for a studio that in today’s terms wasn’t even that big.
Again, not an excuse. They’re a massive studio, big enough to have people that know how to plan a project like this, people that understand their limitations and what is or isn’t achievable. It’s standard project planning practice.
But even then there are allegations that people in the company were aware that the game was not ready to launch.
And yet they still dropped the game.
There is no excuse for the launch of CP2077.
The rest of the AAA producers just realized that CDPR still won loads of money at launch, and decided to release incomplete games on purpose, after seeing that CDPR could make profits that way.
The industry learned this about a decade ago. We’ve been plagued by half baked launched for so long at this point that you don’t have to go far to find out about it.
But must importantly, CDPR did an amazing job at fixing the game, unlike many other studios releasing broken AAAs.
In this case I think it’s less fixing the game and more finishing the development of the game, all things considered. The thing they should have done before releasing the game as if it was a finished product when, in fact, it clearly wasn’t.
There’s fixing a game and there’s what CDPR had to do to CP2077.
Yes, a lot of companies don’t fix their games. But at the same time most of these companies don’t release their games in such a state that they start getting into legal trouble over the launch of their game.
https://www.nme.com/news/cyberpunk-2077-investigated-polish-consumer-protection-agency-2855205
Cyberpunk was such a massive disaster that they didn’t really have much choice other than to finish working on their game. To repair the massive hit to their PR as well as other issues such as the class action and the whole debacle with Sony kicking the game of the PS Store.
Even though it took a while, they still delivered the game they promised to their buyers.
Yes, it’s good that they stuck with the game and did more than the bare minimum to bring it to a better state. But it’s not exactly something to praise them over. It took them ~2 years to bring the game to a state that it should have been in at launch. Instead of launching the game in a finished state, they knowingly dropped the game in an unfinished state. They also put out a review embargo preventing reviewers from informing the consumer about said issues, they actively worked to mislead the consumer about the state of their game.
What CDPR did is absolutely not excusable under any circumstances.
Their next projects should absolutely be scrutinised until they prove that they have learned from their mistakes.
I wouldn’t trust CDPR so easily yet after how diabolical the launch of CP2077 was.
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Making excuses is defending the situation.
“Oh you can ignore it and other programs use more resources” is an excuse for the situation. It also missing the fact that games typically have good reason to be taking up so much resources. Bloatware launchers don’t.
Most people when they have an issue don’t go making excuses unless they’re ignorant or too lazy to want a change. Why else would anyone downplay an issue that theyd be better off without?
Yes, you can make anything look small in comparison to games. It’s a bit disingenuous to compare a launcher to something designed to use a lot of resources such as a game. You can’t really compare games and launchers, they’re completely different kinds of software.
A game has business using all the resources they do. Any launcher that is installed on top of a game that you bought from another storefront doesn’t.
Again, just as users shouldn’t have to put up with bloated games that take up unnecessary resources, they shouldn’t have to deal with unnecessary launchers that take up unnecessary resources.
It doesn’t matter that games are larger because that doesn’t change the point. Point is that these extra launchers just don’t need to be a thing. Whether or not games are larger in comparison is completely irrelevant.
It’s bloatware because they aren’t needed. Thats what bloatware is, unnecessary shit that takes up space and resources when it doesn’t need to. If I bought a game in steam, it should just require Steam to run. Not Origin or Uplay or other bloat on top.
It’s unnecessary no matter the scale. Why should I ignore something taking up 500mb when I can achieve the same thing for 250mb or less? In the end it’s always better to have a leaner system that doesn’t have shit you don’t need taking up any amount of space.
The way you downplay it sounds a lot like you’re trying to make it out as if it’s not an issue.
Games taking up resources doesn’t change anything I said either. Funnily enough though the same thing applies to games, users shouldn’t have to put up with games that take up unnecessary resources either. Just like they shouldn’t have to deal with bloatware launchers that take up unnecessary resources and throw more hoops to jump through.
Not really sure why you’re defending something that’s worse for you. What’s in it for you that you’d rather defend unnecessary launchers over not having to deal with them?
It’s not just one launcher in a lot of cases. Many cases have you also run another launcher such as Ubisoft and EA games that require their launchers to run along side Steam. It all adds up and it doesn’t need to be that way nor does it need defending.
I don’t really understand why you’re defending something thats worse for you than the alternative.
It doesn’t stop being an issue just because you can brush it under the rug and ignore it.
The point is that the user shouldn’t have to work around these extra launchers. How about companies just stop pushing their own bloatware. If you buy a game through Steam, it should just require Steam. Same for GOG and all the others.
And those extra launchers take up unnecessary resources and extra steps between you and the game.
If I buy a game on one launcher, I should only have to deal with that launcher.
There’s thousands of great games out there. I think I can live with missing the odd one here and there.
Surely it should be possible to expose friends lists to games while also allowing friends lists to remain private on profiles.
There’s a “Real Name” section on your profile as well. Though there isn’t a hard requirement to have your real name there.
There are already PS4 emulators. Though they’re extremely early and work a lot closer to how Wine/Proton do rather than traditional emulation IIRC.
The MTX were removed for DD:DA.
Only the original release of the game on Ps3 and 360 had the mtx. So in a way they improved things only to shit it up again.
Agreed. People need to stop treating a companies track record as if it’s a guarantee.
Especially not after seeing so many previously beloved companies go shit/drop a big stinker or two over the years. Like CDPR, Bioware and Arkane.
Companies are ran by people and people can either just make mistakes or otherwise try to chase some extra pennies.
Local man cannot handle favourite game being criticised. Burns own money in protest.
I’m defending it because of disingenuous trogs like you trying to suggest that it’s somehow harming the quality of the game by having a neutered redundant MTX system.
Microtransactions do harm the quality of a game. Especially a fucking $70 single player game.
Again, it’s full priced. DD2 does not need microtransactions.
I’m defending it because you’re trying to suggest that them removing MTX from an already failed title is anything but proof CAPCOM wasn’t interested in putting any investment in the franchise.
They were interested enough in doing a re-release. If you’re interested enough in doing that then you would also be interested enough in slipping in those MTX if they were successful otherwise you’d be missing out on cash. Cash being the one thing companies love the most and would not think twice about getting more. It’d be fucking stupid for them to leave successful MTX out of a game like that.
On the topic of interest, don’t forget as well that DD2 would have come sooner if it weren’t for the director choosing to go for DMC V first.
So it’s not exactly a complete lack of interest. Otherwise the DD2 wouldn’t have come at all.
So again, no, the MTX was likely left out of DA because it just wasn’t successful enough to warrant the time to put it in.
I’m defending it because to call this predatory is like calling a Shih Tzu a predator.
It is predatory.
Again, there’s no reason for it to be in there.
They’re not starved for cash.
It’s a 70$ game so fat stacks going their way.
I’d bet my cock and balls that the MTX is just lining pockets as MTX often does.
I’m defending it because microtransactions aren’t as bad as you’re making them out to be.
Except they are. Were you not around back before MTX kicked off? Back when you could just get shit by playing the game normally without having to bust out your wallet for an extra character or a shiny .png When MTX become the main focus games suffer.
Some of the best games to exist; exist because of the microtransactions that are in them.
“MUH FAVORITE GAME! NO CRITICIZE!”
Kind of knew that the argument was going in that direction. No one in their right mind defends something that has no benefit to themselves like this.
MTX can’t be bad because then that would be something against your favorite games and your favorite games can’t possibly be bad, right?
Other than that, why don’t you go and list off some of those games because I think there may be a pattern. Other than “Muh games”.
Also, some of the best games ever exist do so without needing micro-transactions. Shit, games survived without them for decades before the internet allowed for MTX to exist.
Almost like MTX aren’t actually needed and a good product will make good money on it’s own merit.
There’s also a better way to further monetize a game post-release. It’s called releasing expansions. You know, like what Elden Ring is about to come out. A decent to good sized chunk of content that (hopefully) has had a good amount of care and attention put into it. Rather than selling a fucking JPEG for £15 and calling it a day, selling something that you would have unlocked in a better game by just being good at the game or just preying on people with poor impulse control.
I wholeheartedly support microtransaction systems like this
Stockholm syndrome is some wack shit, I tell ya.
I think the devs have done an incredible job with the game
Bro, you do realize you can enjoy a game and at the same time recognize any problems it has, right? Enjoying a game does not mean you’re obliged in any way to blindly defend a game, downplay it’s issues and only talk good about it.
There’s just no reason for a full priced game by a cash strapped, big ass AAA publishing company, to have micro-transactions.
They’re not a cash starved indie company. But even while Indie games having MTX is a little more understandable, it’s still a bit dubious even there.
I’m almost tempted to buy some of these literally worthless microtransactions simply as a fuck you to all the virtue signalling losers fixating on the game.
Ah yes, waste your own money and let a group of people live rent free in your head. Pretty good way to spite them. While they’re sat there not wasting their money, you’re just throwing yours away. They’ll literally won’t know what hit them. Probably because they’ll have no idea you’re doing it. But still, you go dude. Burn that money! By the way, ever heard of the phrase “Cutting off your nose just to spite your face”?
Dragon’s Dogma 1 had the exact same monetization scheme, minus fast travel. Everything you could buy on the store was easy to earn in game (it is the exact same way in Dragon’s Dogma 2). Dragon’s Dogma 1 was also a failure in Western markets.
The MTX in DD1 were taken out of the game on later releases. Only the original 360 and PS3 releases had them. So as a matter of fact things improved for DD1 before getting worse again for DD2. Likely because the MTX weren’t successful enough to consider for the re-release. After all, why else would they not have them in a later release.
So tell me, if the game was a success in Japanese markets and had this monetization scheme: why would it not have a more aggressive microtransaction scheme for the second game if what you’re saying is to be believed?
A game being successful doesn’t necessarily mean the MTX are also successful. Companies can see where the money is coming from. If they see that the game is selling loads but the MTX isn’t selling much. They’ll probably not bother to put the effort into the MTX for a later title or at least until they think that things have changed and people may be more receptive. Which is likely what we’re seeing here. As above, they took out the MTX for the later releases/DD:DA. Possibly because the MTX in the original release wasn’t all that successful. It’s been a hot few moments since then so they’re trying it again for DD2. That’s why DD2 isn’t worse.
The game is very fun and not once did I think of paying anything beyond 3 dollars on MTX, and that was because I’m impatient. It literally would have been a waste of money, as the game opens up every fast travel point you would need in the post game. It also gives you nigh infinite fast travel items. There is no drop in quality for the game.
Not being personally affected by it doesn’t really change how good/bad the MTX is. It’s predatory on those with poor impulse control.
It doesn’t matter how much items the game gives to you. The MTX just shouldn’t be in the game as a matter of principle.
It’s a fucking £65/$70 single player game. Why are you defending this shit?
You can claim you “pay attention” all you want, but all you’ve done is prove how little you understand what you’re talking about.
You don’t seem to understand. Considering you forgot about the fact that Dark Arisen doesn’t have those MTXs and the implications that brings.
The whole point of the animations being set in stone is to force the player to be mindful of their actions. Don’t commit to an attack unless you’re sure it’s safe to do so. Otherwise you’re going to get caught out.
The slow animations are a deliberate drawback to the more powerful weapons. Being able to swing an UGS around like it’s nothing would make for a fairly unbalanced weapon. If you want a weapon with quicker animations you probably want something more DEX focused. Just look at the Falcion’s animations compared to the Zweihander’s animations in Dark Souls for example. Zweihander puts out bigger damage numbers and thus attacks slower. Pretty basic balancing concept to have thing that does big damage be slower.
The lack of being able to abort moves is simply a way for the game to punish poor decisions. If you get caught out by a slow animation then you probably need to work on picking when to attack. A big part of the game is that it teaches the player through punishing mistakes. That’s why it forces you to commit to actions.
These only come across as clunky if you’re not learning from your mistakes and working around these deliberate limitations. Pick different weapons or pick better moments to attack/use an item so you don’t commit to something at the wrong moment.
The input queue is another thing that lines up with this. I believe the whole point is to, again, push the user into being careful. Dark Souls isn’t a hack and slash like DMC. You don’t want to go into fights button mashing. The game wants you to take your time. The button queue kind of reinforces that by punishing button mashing and being too hasty. I do also find it useful in queuing certain actions like attacking straight out of a roll or following item usage.
All the things you describe as clunky each have a purpose. The game expects you to work with those limitations and when you do you get a better experience. Going against them is when you run into issues. Since youre attempting to doing things the game is trying to discourage. Like button mashing (input queue) and getting too greedy with attacks (Being locked to actions/Longer animations).