Summary

Trump plans to lift the Biden administration’s freeze on supplying 2,000-pound bombs to Israel and reverse sanctions against Israeli settlers.

  • Railcar8095@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    107
    arrow-down
    10
    ·
    22 hours ago

    Not to beat the dead horse but… Those who said “I won’t vote Democratic because Gaza” were either lying or delusional.

    In 2028 there won’t be any Gaza, what will be the next line?

    • Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      7
      arrow-down
      3
      ·
      edit-2
      8 hours ago

      That’s just self-indugent tribalist scapegoating using an argument which is circular and self-disproving.

      • If there were too few people who cared about the Israeli Genocide enough for it to affect the vote, which is would justify the decision of the Democrat leadership to not do anything meaningful to agree with the demands of those voters (Biden pausing his own decision of sending 2000lb bombs is very much a “I’m saving you from myself” moment), then you can’t really blame those few people for the Democrat loss since there were not enought of them to make a difference and something else made the Democracts lose, so the fault is in the strategy followed by the Democrat leadership on other subjects.
      • If on the other hand there were so many people who cared about the Israeli Genocide enough for it to result in the Democrats losing the vote, why did the Democrat candidates not go after that vote? Again, the blame is down to the choices of the Democrat leadership: it’s always easier to change what a handfull of people do than to change what millions do, so for the handful of people in the Democrat Party leadership to change their position with regards to supporting Israeli in its Genocide would be far more logical to expect in that scenario than for such a large slice of the electorate - millions of voters - to change their position instead. Even if one thinks “our leader’s position is more important than that of millions of people so it’s the millions who have to change their positions, not our leader” (a bootlicker’s mindset, BTW), it’s still incredibly stupid to go with “we’re going to convince millions to change their position rather than just that one guy” as a strategy so the blame still rests with those who chose to go with it.

      All I see here and now is people making a pseudo-“argument” that is entirelly reliant on the axiom that “the boss is always right” to manage to somehow blame millions for something which the “the boss” could have (per the part of that very same pseudo-“argument” which claims it was the people who were against the Israeli Genocide that sawyed the vote) easilly avoided by just meaningufully changing his position on just that one subject. That presumption that the leaders are blameless and it’s the peons who are to blame for not being willing to follow the leaders no mater what they were doing, is a 100% subservient mindset.

      If you’re going to assign blame for Trump, look at the handful of people in the Democrat Party who chose to do things in such a way that the results was that millions of their own electorate chose not to vote for them, thus delivering the election to Trump.

      • Railcar8095@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        4 hours ago

        Sorry, didn’t pass the second line because you failed to understand what I say.

        I’m not saying Biden is good for Gaza. I’m saying if your concern is Gaza, Trump is not better. So for a meaningless virtue signaling, everything else is worse.

      • Bytemeister@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        3 hours ago

        Yeah, but when do they ever stop at just one group? When the Nazis started running low on Jews to scapegoat, they expanded their operation to include gays, gypsies, handicapped…etc.

    • splinter@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      49
      arrow-down
      4
      ·
      21 hours ago

      This is the tragic truth.

      The most frustrating part about it is that withholding votes was framed as a principled position. And I’m sorry, but that’s asinine. How many of those people who declared that they wouldn’t vote for the democratic ticket because of their action/inaction on Gaza actually did anything more than posting rants on social media? How many raised funds for aid? How many organized rallies, protests, or educational outreach? How many even so much as contacted their representatives?

      It is either naivety or complacency to believe that national policy should change just because you and your friends sent around some memes. And it is callous indifference to base your vote on a single issue and then claim that you’re inhabiting the moral high ground.

      If you yell into the void, you shouldn’t expect a response. And if you believe in an issue, either take action or acknowledge that it would be staggeringly arrogant to expect other people to put in work that you yourself won’t do.

      • clutchtwopointzero@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        9 hours ago

        The American non-Republican voters were played like a fiddle. Long live Tik Tok who fed the indignation and enabled Trump’s victory!

    • LePoisson@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      28
      arrow-down
      7
      ·
      21 hours ago

      I think most of them were state sponsored psyops or really shit trolls. I don’t think most actual real marginally rational thinking people would have such a dumb af take.

      • peregrin5@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        5
        ·
        15 hours ago

        Trump being elected is enough proof for me to realize most people in our country have dumb af takes.

      • socsa@piefed.social
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        13
        arrow-down
        3
        ·
        20 hours ago

        As if you need any additional evidence how .ml and their spinoffs are funded

      • Zorque@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        14
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        21 hours ago

        You would think, and yet they’re still around parrotting the same narrative. Hell, there’s at least one in the comments of this very post.

        Assuming that anyone with a contrary opinion, no matter how ridiculous you might feel it is, is being disingenuous is an easy way to underestimate them.

      • samus12345@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        9
        arrow-down
        3
        ·
        21 hours ago

        I don’t think most Americans care enough about Gaza for it to affect their vote (or for it to cause them to choose not to vote). Some, certainly, but not enough to have made a difference. This was about groceries being expensive.

        • NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          12
          arrow-down
          7
          ·
          21 hours ago

          It was a combined effort to suppress voter turnout. Provide every possible reason to tap into that bernie bro “the democrats deserve to lose because they betrayed me” mindset.

            • Zorque@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              5
              arrow-down
              1
              ·
              20 hours ago

              The problem being that means too many people don’t show up, and only the fanatics get a say. And they have a lot more than us.

              • ℍ𝕂-𝟞𝟝@sopuli.xyz
                link
                fedilink
                English
                arrow-up
                7
                arrow-down
                2
                ·
                20 hours ago

                That’s exactly my point. People should go and vote against fascism, but apparently they won’t.

                And Harris wasn’t inspiring enough to get them out to vote for her instead of just against him.

                • Zorque@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  5
                  arrow-down
                  3
                  ·
                  19 hours ago

                  Your point seemed to be “She sucks, maybe not as much as the other guy, but still sucks”, which is not exactly inspiring in and of itself. maybe you should do less to try and discredit the currently most viable defense we have against people like Trump.

                  You have serious problems if you needs additional inspiration beyond literal fascism.

                  • peregrin5@lemm.ee
                    link
                    fedilink
                    English
                    arrow-up
                    1
                    ·
                    14 hours ago

                    Thank God some lemmys here have actual brains. These folks will scream up and down the street to anyone who will listen how horrible the Dem candidate is, and then wonder why voter turnout is low despite swearing they “totally went out and voted for Dems” even when they didn’t want to. Sure.

          • grue@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            7
            arrow-down
            2
            ·
            edit-2
            20 hours ago

            That fake “Bernie bro” mindset, you mean. No genuine Bernie bro failed to vote (D) in the general, by definition, because that’s what Bernie himself recommended.

    • Zorque@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      4
      ·
      22 hours ago

      They’ve already made inroads into the West Bank, Syria, and Lebanon, right?